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Apr 29, 2025

The Best & The Brightest
Instagram
Peter Hamby Peter Hamby

Welcome back to The Best & The Brightest. I’m Peter Hamby. I had a
blast seeing so many of you in D.C. over the weekend. Shoutout to Abby Phillip for not judging my late-night Chicken McNuggets order on Friday after the UTA party.

Tonight, my breakdown of Pete Buttigieg’s foray into the so-called “manosphere,” with a remarkable appearance on Andrew Schulz’s Flagrant podcast that showed how Democrats can win back young men—if they’re willing to get a little uncomfortable in the process.

A MESSAGE FROM INSTAGRAM

Instagram
Instagram

Congress can help keep teens safe with app store parental approval.

 

3 of 4 parents agree that teens under 16 shouldn’t be able to download apps without their approval. 

 

Federal legislation requiring app store parental approval and age verification for teens under 16 would put parents in charge of teen app downloads – and help them keep teens safe.

 

Learn more.

But first, here’s Abby on the latest Hill chatter…

Abby Livingston Abby Livingston
 

A.O.C. Oversight Murmurs

House Dems I’ve spoken with are absolutely gutted over the news that Virginia
Democratic Rep. Gerry Connolly’s cancer has returned and that he plans to retire from Congress. Connolly, of course, is the ranking member on House Oversight, the Hill’s most politically charged committee, and speculation is already swirling about who will take his slot. Most eyes are trained on Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, who mounted a surprisingly strong challenge to the 75-year-old late last year.

But it’s complicated. After losing the
Oversight race, A.O.C. won a shiny consolation prize with an appointment to the Energy and Commerce Committee—and left Oversight altogether. The notion that she might now run for, and win, a contest to become the ranking member of a committee that she’s not even on would set a striking new precedent that may not go over well with some of her colleagues. (The congresswoman deflected
reporters’ queries on Monday about her potential Oversight ambitions, and her office did not respond to my own.)

Still, norms are changing in the House Democratic caucus. And the chatter speaks to the ongoing vibe shift among Democrats; until six months ago, it was conventional wisdom that committee leaders were selected based on seniority—a reward for slowly climbing up the ranks. If A.O.C. runs and wins, that would further upend caucus tradition after a handful of ranking
member upsets last fall. (And would she even want the job if it means giving up a coveted spot on E&C?) In any case, as my partner Leigh Ann noted yesterday, Rep. Stephen Lynch
is next in line to run the committee, and will step in for Connolly while the race heats up.

Pete Enters the Manosphere…

Pete Enters the Manosphere…

Pete Buttigieg boldly went into the kind of space other Democrats have
feared to tread—a podcast of guys being dudes—and walked away with a clear W.

Peter Hamby Peter Hamby

Here are some of the topics Pete Buttigieg discussed on the
Flagrant podcast last week: the White Lotus incest scene, cancer research, Grindr, Fox News, Chinese currency manipulation, lesbian college radio stations in Iowa, progressive taxation, fatherhood, “chick flights into space,” tariffs, whether food in Afghanistan turned him gay, Boston crime rates, corporate offshoring, the United Nations, subways, the Cold War, cancel culture, TikTok. That’s just a start.

Flagrant, hosted by comedians Andrew Schulz
and Akaash Singh, bills itself as a “podcast that delivers unfiltered, unapologetic, and unruly hot takes directly to your dome piece.” The show is one of the larger nodes in the so-called manosphere, an umbrella term that’s become so overstretched and politically burdened that it’s basically lost all meaning. Feminist writers, scholars, and many progressives in the Donald Trump era lump almost every genre of problematic dude into the manosphere: 4chan
ghouls and gamers, incels, influencers like Andrew Tate or Twitch streamer Adin Ross, masculinity guru Jordan Peterson, even life-hacker Andrew Huberman.

It’s a miasma that helped elect Trump, who made podcasts a cornerstone of his campaign strategy, as many 2024 postmortems have noted to the point of exhaustion. A poll by Echelon Insights found that among Trump voters in the U.S. last year, 14 percent had seen Trump’s
Flagrant interview with Schulz during the election cycle. That’s a lot. Only Joe Rogan’s and Theo Von’s pod interviews with Trump had higher numbers, Echelon found.

A MESSAGE FROM INSTAGRAM

Instagram
Instagram

App store parental approval can help keep teens safe online.

Today, teens can download any app – even ones parents don’t want them to. Federal legislation that puts parents in charge of app downloads could change that, helping keep teens safe. 

 

That’s why Instagram supports federal legislation requiring app store parental approval and age verification for teens under 16.

 

Learn more.

But the Flagrant pod, like Von’s This Past Weekend or Matt and
Shane’s Secret Podcast
with Shane Gillis, isn’t part of some sinister right-wing project premised on hating women or slobbering over Trump. It’s a show fronted by some millennial comedian friends talking shit about whatever—just guys being dudes—which is exactly why it’s become so popular, with almost 2 million followers on YouTube and many more on Spotify and Apple. It is precisely the kind of space where Democrats need to be hanging out if they want to have any chance of
clawing back men under 40 who flipped to Trump last November. “It is truly insane that the Republican Party has beaten the Dems as being the guys who are dudes,” said Kurt Pickhardt, a Republican strategist based in South Carolina. “Take a time machine back to the ’90s and tell young men that it’s actually the Democrats who become the tight asses.”

The newly bearded Buttigieg walked into an environment that most Democrats have been too scared to enter, and walked
away with a clear W in almost every way: He was relatable, relaxed, funny, smart, humble, and brimming with pro-Dem data points and fact checks that made the hosts go “Huh,” and “Ohhh,” over and over again. The episode has 1.2 million views so far—more views than Flagrant episodes with celebs like Jelly Roll and Lil Yachty, more than their episode with Barstool Sports founder Dave Portnoy, and more than their interviews with thirsty
MAGA types like Vivek Ramaswamy and Chamath Palihapitiya.

If there’s a conversation that Democrats should be having now in the wake of Buttigieg’s successful Flagrant appearance, it’s not about whether he should run for president, whether he can even win, or whether he’s too short, too gay, or too hated by dogmatic leftists who think he’s a moderate squish. It’s about what other Democrats can learn about how to communicate in a media environment
that left them behind a decade ago.

The
Ur-Text of Democratic Media Strategy

Buttigieg’s Flagrant appearance is so sneaky good that it’s pretty much the
ur-text of what Democratic media strategy should look like over the next four years. I was hanging with a bunch of beleaguered Democrats last Friday night in Washington at a White House Correspondents’ Dinner party hosted by Crooked Media, the progressive media outfit, and Buttigieg’s appearance was top of mind for pretty much everyone I talked to. “It shows a hunger for content that isn’t just the three-minute interview,” said Dan Koh, a former top advisor in the
Biden White House. He himself recently launched a podcast, The People’s Cabinet, to help demystify good government and talk to voters who don’t bother with traditional media.

Victor Shi, a Gen Z Democratic influencer and communications strategist, reposted a two-minute clip of Buttigieg on Flagrant discussing the importance of government research and federal grants that the Trump administration is threatening. Shi’s video alone now has
6.6 million views on X. Meanwhile, the almost 10,000 comments on Flagrant’s YouTube channel are a breath of fresh air in toxic times. One commenter: “I voted Trump but ngl Pete made a lot of good points.” Another: “Not a Dem, but Pete here is the real deal. Great episode.” Another: “Honestly i just wanna throw huge respect to this comment section. No useless aggression, an overall welcoming environment, generally positive vibes. Damn near all of y’all behaving admirably as fuck.” Mayor Pete:
Making Comments Sections Tolerable Again.

Rob Flaherty, who ran digital strategy in the Biden White House and for Kamala Harris’s presidential campaign, and who had been urging Democrats to quit their dangerous addiction to traditional media, said Buttigieg’s appearance on the podcast was about as good as it gets. “He was conversational, open to engaging, hung out for a long time,” Flaherty told me. “He’s now being rewarded for it: The clips from the
interview are everywhere and breaking through to the kind of opt-out voters who haven’t [had] Democrats meet them where they are in a long time.”

Flaherty published an essay in The New York Times yesterday about the need for Democrats to communicate with the “opt-out” voters who decided the election, not just the “opt-in” voters whom Democrats already cater to, i.e., people with college degrees who follow the news intensely. The latter makes up a rather small
minority of Americans. Democrats pretty much own them at this point, but today’s tastemakers and information-brokers are in social media feeds and behind podcast mics, not in mainstream newsrooms. “The right owns where voters are going,” Flaherty wrote. “It leaves Democrats unable to influence the culture that really matters today, which leaves us unable to make our case to the voters we need.”

By now, the phrase “meeting voters where they are” has become a cliché when Democrats talk
about how to reach casual voters, as they think about how to get a message out beyond the Times and MSNBC and to compete with Republicans online. And Buttigieg is the rare politician who makes these kinds of appearances look easy. There’s another common refrain you hear from Democrats when they talk about Buttigieg: He’s so good at this. But for all the promise of Pete’s podcast success, his skills also highlight what most Democrats can’t do. It’s more than just
Buttigieg’s talents in front of the camera, his ease with facts. He’s also willing to say yes to interviews in the first place—and unlike most people in politics, he’s actually compelling enough to get invited on by hosts who also want to interview 50 Cent, Timothée Chalamet, and Kay Adams. Congressional backbenchers who love getting mentioned in Playbook aren’t on their radar.

To consider how difficult this feat is for a politician, Dems
need to ask themselves three important questions: How many party leaders are famous enough in the culture to get invited on Rogan or Theo Von or Flagrant in the first place? How many of those Democrats would actually say yes to the booking, and happily sit next to cans of Republican-coded Black Rifle Coffee and spitball for an hour or more about everything from “chicks” and space aliens to questions about trans athletes? And how many of those Dems could
actually survive, have genuine fun, and win over the hosts and the audience? The list of capable Democrats in this thought experiment is vanishingly small.

Pete’s
DGAF Mode

For a foray into the manosphere, whatever that means, the Flagrant episode
wasn’t really a frat-house hazing at all. At one point in the nearly three-hour interview, which also touched on Social Security, infrastructure, DOGE, and the downstream effects of tariff policy in red states, Schulz asked Buttigieg why the Democrats these days so often fail to do the Bill Clinton thing—I feel your pain—when trying to connect with voters on an emotional level. “‘Build the Wall’ wasn’t about building the wall,” Schulz prodded, asking why Dems avoided
talking about immigration concerns for so long. “It was an idea that satisfied a concern that people felt.” Buttigieg agreed with him, and jabbed at the scolds in his own party. “There is not enough persuasion,” he said. “We used to have actual landslides in this country. I think our party should aspire to be a 60 percent party.” (It needs to be said here that fellow Democrat Gavin Newsom was savaged by progressives for making roughly the same argument when launching his new
podcast back in February.)

Instagram
Instagram

For all the contempt that liberals throw at male podcast hosts in chin-stroking
columns and Bluesky posts, it’s clear they don’t actually watch or listen to any of them. And if Democratic politicians don’t, their staffers should. Like Portnoy, Schulz voted for Trump, and became a loud critic of Democrats in the Biden era, saying what most Democratic insiders believe to be true: that the party let itself be defined by culture wars instead of kitchen table issues. But Schulz is not a red-capped MAGA soldier.

Yes, Schulz says dumb shit, like he did just a few weeks ago,
when he said he quit the Democratic Party because Democrats are lame, whereas Trump “likes p*ssy.” He’s a comedian, not a public intellectual. (And polls show that most Americans agree on the first part—Democrats are lame.) Schulz’s last Netflix special was about him and his wife struggling with IVF and his journey to fatherhood. When he interviewed Trump last year on Flagrant, it was chummy, but he also interrogated him about the Dobbs decision on abortion, pressing him on
Republican chatter about banning IVF. Schulz also laughed in the president’s face when Trump claimed he is “mostly a truthful person.” All of this is to say: Flagrant is not Meet the Press, and that’s why a lot of people like it.

Where’s
the Talent?

Buttigieg has been pushing into unusual media spaces for years, of course, going back to
his insurgent 2020 presidential bid, when podcasts and digital shows were happy to have the little-known Democrat while rival candidates like Biden and Elizabeth Warren were more interested in the five-minute cable news hit, despite its shrinking relevance. Back in that primary, only Bernie Sanders and Andrew Yang were invited on Rogan, because their ideas were provocative and deviated from the norm, and like Buttigieg and his
strategist Lis Smith, they were willing to go anywhere to get their messages out. “These are partly the habits that I formed when I was an unheard-of, 30-something-year-old Indiana mayor running for president,” Buttigieg told the Flagrant hosts when Singh asked why Democrats are so spooked by podcasts.

These days, Buttigieg is armed with more skills and more confidence, thanks to four years working in the federal government as Biden’s Secretary of Transportation
and a crucial surrogate (especially since the president was no one’s idea of a clear communicator). But his aides tell me he’s also in a bit of DGAF mode postelection—if the beard wasn’t a tell. “I think Pete realizes you can’t play it safe all of the time,” said Chris Meagher, a longtime advisor. Buttigieg has been making the media rounds lately—Colbert, Jon Stewart’s podcast, some Instagram lives, CNN—talking about whatever the hosts want to talk
about. His Stewart interview blew up much like Flagrant: It’s now passed 2 million views on YouTube, a bigger audience than Stewart’s interview with Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, perhaps the only other star in the Democratic Party with comparable media intuition.

Ocasio-Cortez is worth throwing into the manosphere conversation, because shows like Flagrant offer male politicians an obvious advantage: the ability to bro out while chasing the bro vote. In a
brilliant New York Times profile of Theo Von last week, the writer Jon Caramanica calculated that less than 20 percent of Von’s guests in the past 12 months have been women. A quick scan of Schulz’s guests reveals roughly the same. While Josh Shapiro has been appearing on sports pods—and Newsom has been podcasting with former NFL star Marshawn Lynch for years—in my conversations over the past few days, I’ve had a hard time finding a
Democratic operative who thinks Ocasio-Cortez or Warren or Gretchen Whitmer could pull off the same kind of freewheeling interview that Buttigieg did last week.

Kamala Harris ably showed up on several male-hosted podcasts last fall, like the NBA podcast All the Smoke, and she was relaxed and compelling in an interview with radio host Charlamagne tha God in Detroit. But in Wilmington, late campaign conversations about her appearing on Rogan’s
podcast became tortured, as Harris and her advisors weighed the pros and cons, with concerns over which kinds of wildcard questions might get thrown her way. (Taxpayer-funded transgender surgeries for prisoners was surely right there in his quiver.) At that point in the race, it was already too late for Democrats to make up the Republican edge in the podcast space that had been under construction for years.

As for A.O.C., whose presidential prospects I
examined last week, she’s proven her media talents when it comes to gaming, livestreams, pods, and plenty of nontraditional media spaces. She can hold court with almost anyone. But as the congresswoman eyes 2028, it has to be asked: Would she go on a bro-cast? Unlike Bernie Sanders, she remains beholden to certain elements of the identity left and has advocated for ideas—prison
abolition!—that might have her playing too much defense with decidedly unwoke hosts. And if she ever does tiptoe into the manosphere, would Brooklyn leftists back home scream at her for “sanewashing cis fascism” or whatever radical chic cri de coeur comes her way? A.O.C. can do it—but will she?

The opportunity is there for Democrats, but is the talent? The latest Harvard
Youth Poll
found last week that young men—like most voters—are running away from Trump as he messes with the economy and fails to follow through on his promises to lower prices and end foreign wars. The Harvard poll found that Trump’s disapproval rating with young men now stands at 59 percent, having skyrocketed since he won the election. But the poll was equally bad news for Democrats: Young men might be turning on Trump, but they still view Dems as useless. Those opinions won’t change
unless they actually hear what Democrats are saying. “People who run for office want to win,” Buttigieg told Schulz. “But for me, it’s worth some risk in order to reach everybody.”

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